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Debate about the recently added advertisements

1911

Comments

  • ZoeZoe Moderator Posts: 16,810
    Zoe said:
    Zoe said:
    Zoe said:

    With the adds, the information "in question" is 60 adds per 60 mins. One add lasts 30 seconds, so even without having an information on how often can the adds appear, everyone should feel like it may be a bit exaggerated (would anyone really stay an hour on game just watching adds, one by one, without being able to play, because 30s are barely enough to do anything?) - and when we have confirmed information this is not possible, I do not feel there's anything wrong with saying it and preventing misleading information from spreading (because "no one denied it so it must be true").

    @Zoe as always, thank you for not only relying, but also how you reply.  On the above point however, I took the time to prove that a non-paying player can get 12 ads an hour.  One every 5 mins.  This was not misleading information.  I do understand that you and the other Mods can "neither confirm nor deny" that I am correct, but I know what I did and that the number is correct.  In THIS case, since no one denies it nor confirms it, it leaves a very bitter taste in the mouth.
    As I can't disclose anything, I can't fully reply you the way I'd like. However, you probably see the significant difference between the claim someone got 60 adds in 60 minutes and your own observation which gave you the result of 12 per 60 minutes - and comparing these two, I still insist the original claim (60 per hour) was misleading. 

    It's also important to realise there was a choice between making it mandatory to pay for the game and adding adds - and I believe adding adds will cause less harm/is more bearable for f2p players. On top of that, you can pay approx. 1,5€ per 20 months (and get rubies) to avoid them, which I believe isn't too much.

    I do, however, agree 12 adds per hour is still quite a lot, I am definitely not denying that. We have forwarded all your feedback (actually, several times) and also many suggestions to make it less disturbing (I believe some of them have a fair chance to be applied, some probably smaller)...

    Zoe said:
    3 weeks on nothing and this alliance has a MODERATOR in it so i guess it must be legal .
    Mods do not have any ingame rights, we are here to moderate forums. So mod has zero influence over what his alliance members do, just like any other player has no control over his alliance members. 
    I'd also suggest you to avoid further unsubstantiated accusations (in accordance with guidelines - part III 1 A). If you have any proof, support is the right place for this, not forums.

    About mods for english forum, there are four, as far as I know - Poseidon, Thanatos, Neroxnex and Temprance. On top of that, any player is free to apply - however I believe it's not always easy to find suitable "candidate" and GGS can't really change that...

    In case you have any complaints about specific moderator, you should firstly contact them privately and try to sort it out. In case you're not able to solve it, you're free to approach CM via private message in that matter (or possibly support, in case you don't get response from CM - I'm not sure how much time they have left for reading/answering PMs), however you should always have specific evidence/examples. 
    As for this comment, I used to play INT1 and believe I know who the EX-Mod being referred to here is.  The problem is that she IS an Ex-Mod.  Some still think she is a Mod.  In looking at the game play in the recent past, I no longer believe it is the same person in the account.  THAT brings a lot of questions.  How does an Ex-Mod's game account get run by a different player?  I am purposely NOT naming the account nor the Ex-Mod as I have NO PROOF to my belief.  However, those who play INT1 know who it is and why I would say what I do.  What I CAN confirm, is it is not any of the current 4 Mods.  
    Oh, well... to become a moderator, you need to have clear record both ingame and on forum and if you happen to break ingame rules while being mod, you can (and most likely will) be let gone. But that's pretty much all (game-wise), as in the game are mods being treated the very same way as all other players - so this also applies when it comes to breaking ToS (it has the same priority level as if any other player broke the rules and it needs to be proven the same way and with the same certainty). 
    It of course doesn't look good if people get the expression that former team member broke the rules (whether it's true or not), but we are just humans and CM/GGS have very limited power over what ex-mod decides to do with their ingame account. This can be one of the many reasons why mods are being selected carefully and why it isn't so easy to find suitable candidates :)
    bernhardt (US1) said:
    This has not been an unusual circumstance for mods here in the english forum.  Might be because most of them are/were in high performing top tier alliances, which have a distinctly different playing experience from those not in those top tier alliances.

    I thank the volunteer mods for their efforts because it pretty much is a thankless no win situation/job.
    I echo the above part of the statement from @bernhardt (US1).   There are a large number of non-buying players who also use the Forum.  There are a large number of "casual" players as well.  When those of us express our experience with the game, the answer is often from the viewpoint of the Top 200.  These are very different viewpoints.  Simple example is if 50M coins is a lot or not.  LOL!    For those in the Top 200, it is a couple hours effort.  For many people, they could NEVER imagine having 50M coins.  I do give @Poseidon X Angel credit for acknowledging this recently.  I am hoping that translates into a new understanding for the viewpoint of  those who are not Top 200.  This viewpoint needs to be represented and since those IN the Top 200 do not share it, it can be difficult to pass along.

    I also agree with the final statement above.  I thank those who volunteer for the position of Mod.  It really is a very difficult place to put yourself into.  If you say nothing, people get mad.  If you say something that you are asked to pass along from GGS (that you may or may not agree with) that is not popular with the players, the "feedback" hits you all directly.  You each then pass along a more structured and orderly "report" to GGS.  Many Players think that a more "Direct" feedback to GGS would have a bigger impact.  This may or may not be true.  But, you are in a bit of a No-Win situation many times.
    I believe Poseidon gave very nice response to this and I actually don't have much to add, so I'll keep it short. 
    There's a big variety among mods - when it comes to moderating, responding/interacting with users and also when it comes to the game. You'll find some top players, whales, but also f2p and some "lazy" mods (that's where I proudly belong :D) and also the ones who are anywhere between the extremes. This allows us to discuss together things from different perspectives and helps us to understand other points of views better.
    Apart from that, we all should be able to separate our personal point of view from the feedback we receive and forward (so if I personally dislike certain change, but receive positive feedback about it from other people, then I simply forward the positive feedback and the fact that the feature is overall liked, even if I personally disagree with it) - and I believe this is not only what "should" be happening, but that is also is happening. 

    And for the 50m - It definitely is a lot. However, it's not impossible, even if you don't play that much - basically, all you need is try hard on one nomads (with using chests from blacksmith) and then sell most of the tablets for gold. My hand nearly fell of while selling them, but it gives you a lot :D  However, in this case, the feedback from majority was taken into consideration and adjustments had been made.
    Zoe said: 

    Anyway thank you for being brave enough to post, we were afraid we scared you all by suddenly appearing here D 

    No, we didn't get scared off.  I DID decide to take a few days to let this thread sit since it had been combined.  It can do us all some good, when we take a breath or two...........

    I totally agree with this. And I have to say, thank you for your post - that's an amazing example of giving"valuable feedback" which can get us somewhere rather then just "complaining" :)
    ive only read the first two paragraphs of this book you wrote sorry

    but oh imagine if they made it so you pay to play the game. It would be amazing because they would have no choice but to reduce the ruby player and free player gap!!!!

    Tell them to do it now! And do it quickly!
    Hmm, that's what each book-writer wants to hear... that no one read it :D 

    I personally think GGS has done pretty good job with reducing the gap with blacksmith... but what make you think that "fee for playing" would force to make them any changes to further reduce the gap?

    @Zoe @Poseidon X Angel  Thanks for your responses throughout this whole discussion.  I for one have a better appreciation for just what you guys do.

    A suggestion for you guys for those canned GGE responses and communications you have to post:  Suggest to GGE a less politician tone to them.
    Hmm, with responses it depends... I mean, we get them in a certain way (and there's basically zero chance someone will change the extent of info we get and can share just because we request it :sweat_smile:) and then it's up to everyone how will they interprete them and how much they'll "change" them (the form, without changing the meaning) before they communicate them to their communities... so I think this is perhaps more of a request on @Poseidon X Angel :smirk:

    "I personally think GGS has done pretty good job with reducing the gap with blacksmith... but what make you think that "fee for playing" would force to make them any changes to further reduce the gap?"

    Heavily because when people realise the game is crom even though you have to pay for it and they keep asking for more money still for basic functions like automatically removing all that garbage armour we got stockpiled up (i mean thats just utter stupidity that we actually have to do that) gge will lose players so will have to give all players basic functions and perhaps even listen to the players because there wont be enough money that their ears are covered anymore with it which would be crazy.
    Hmm, that’s an interesting view, however I don’t think it would be the case - people know the game (and I believe new players would have some free trial time), so they would be able to decide if they wanted to pay for using it or not, in the state in which it is - so, what I think “usage fee” would possibly cause is outflow of f2p players, rather change of the game into their favour (and that’s why I’d say adds are less harmful/limiting option)...

    Well, the ads havent been too bad (YET).  There is the SKIP AD button after 5 seconds, just like at certain video sharing sites.  But what I am seeing in OR is HORRIBLE LAG.  

    Never seen it this bad.  Logged it 3 times hoping it would clear up.  Nope.  So far not seeing that lag in Main Game.  Good thing too.  Just had a triple tap to setup def for.
    That lag was related to the huge surge in people searching for alliances by language. Rather than the normal start to the event where people don't tend to search as actively we had a massive upswing in searches.

    As for the advertisements, we have collated the feedback from here and we will bring it to the attention of the studio. While the advertisements won't be going anywhere we will see what refinements might be made.


    Much better than the previous version ^^

    By the way, to me it makes sense that (probably) most moderators who play the game are very active players and/or payers. Because: why would someone not spending much time playing at all be interested in spending a lot of time moderating?
    I’d like to respond to this part, as “someone not spending much time playing” sort of describes me. 
    Personally, I’ve been on forum (old vbulletin, if anyone still remembers :D) pretty much ever since I started playing the game. There was very active community full of amazing and fun people (you can call them spammers), and it was overall more active than nowadays (I personally suppose it’s sort of because the game wasn’t so “entertaining” as now - you didn’t have events all the time, so at times the only thing you could hit were towers and other players, or one single event, plus you didn’t have time skips - so people were killing some spare time on forum, while waiting for attacks to land and for targets to stop burning and stuff). While I was killing time there by playing forum games and talking to others, there were also people asking (basic) questions, so I eventually started to respond (as I was there anyway, so why not, if I knew the answers, right?).
    Eventually our CM offered me mod position and I agreed - not because I somehow specially cared about the game, but because I was active on the forum anyway, liked the community and also enjoyed helping out people. I saw being a mod and getting closer contact with CM as a way for me to help them (other players) out more/better, and it didn’t require any extra time compared to what I was already spending there and it also didn’t require me to do many more tasks (at that time, each forum had own CM(s) who usually had the time to read suggestions/bugs/updates feedback, max what I had to do was link them a thread if they missed something, so as a mod I basically just answered questions and managed threads/posts) :)
    The tasks of mods have changed quite a lot over the time and I totally see why it would attract especially people who care about the game a lot now.... but I have simply somehow stayed :D
  • Wiglema (NL1)Wiglema (NL1) NL1 Posts: 730
    Because of you @Zoe I wrote "most moderators". ;)
    I've been that odd one out myself, as a moderator in a forum for a different game many years ago, so I think I know very well what you're talking about. Anyway, in the early days the forum was much more part of the game experience than it is now.
    Keep doing what you do and be aware that there are people who actually read your "books" entirely from the beginning to the end. :D
    Wiglema (NL1)
  • ZoeZoe Moderator Posts: 16,810
    edited 12.11.2020
  • Herveus (AU1)Herveus (AU1) AU1 Posts: 11,051

    You need or want help to become a better player shoot me a message in the forums or here I'll gladly help you out for free

    In h
    ibernation nov2019-now
  • Joe Pineapples (GB1)Joe Pineapples (GB1) GB1 Posts: 16
    edited 13.11.2020
    I've just returned to the game after a short break and what's the first thing I get?  An Ad that GGS have generously said I can get rid of if I purchase something.

    Nah, sorry chuck that 'aint gonna happen.  In my opinion, GGS have systematically devalued the enjoyment of the game and driven players away over the last couple of years by introducing initiatives that are nothing more than money spinners.  This one puts the tin lid on them all.

    OK I understand you're a business and that you do this to make money, but the game does need to actively encourage a cadre of players who either don't purchase, or do so occasionally.  It's these players that keep the game alive, not the 3-5% who spend £££££ 's on rubies or bundles in the shop.  In my opinion, that 3-5% would soon go and find another game to plough their money into if the other 95% weren't there for them (and their credit card) to lord it over.

    Will I log on every day now?  I doubt it.  Will I do my occasional purchase again? Not on your Nelly Hawkins. Will I go and find another game that has better graphics, fresh gameplay and doesn't try and rinse the players for money? Quite probably.

    Decided to edit this a bit and tone it down, because I just noticed that I've been warned by the moderators regarding my comments in a previous post.  It's a shame they aren't so vigilant about actively detecting and barring those who flagrantly breach the Ts & Cs of the game.
  • Poseidon X AngelPoseidon X Angel Moderator Posts: 1,355
    Decided to edit this a bit and tone it down, because I just noticed that I've been warned by the moderators regarding my comments in a previous post.  It's a shame they aren't so vigilant about actively detecting and barring those who flagrantly breach the Ts & Cs of the game.
    Moderators are players just like you, our privileges are limited to the discord server and our forums.
    I wish I could help you sort with in game issues too but unfortunately I can't.
  • Wasso (INT3)Wasso (INT3) INT3 Posts: 3,332
    Druids (GB1) said:
    Says it all. Same as every problem raised, no change. Excuses, waffle, and misdirection.
    You expected them to remove the ads completely?  That would have been a dream.

    What is reasonable in my opinion?  NO ads that block game play.  You can run as many as you want, if they do not block our pressing of the buttons.  There are plenty of mobile apps that run an ad at the bottom of the screen CONSTANTLY.  Doesn't interfere with the function of the app.

    Do that.   I will not complain.

    Well, not about THAT anyway.  Might complain about what the ads are, if there are too many feminine hygiene product ones...... 
    Good night.
    Sleep well.
    I'll most likely kill you in the morning.




  • Wasso (INT3)Wasso (INT3) INT3 Posts: 3,332
    Druids (GB1) said:
    Says it all. Same as every problem raised, no change. Excuses, waffle, and misdirection.
    You expected them to remove the ads completely?  That would have been a dream.

    What is reasonable in my opinion?  NO ads that block game play.  You can run as many as you want, if they do not block our pressing of the buttons.  There are plenty of mobile apps that run an ad at the bottom of the screen CONSTANTLY.  Doesn't interfere with the function of the app.

    Do that.   I will not complain.

    Well, not about THAT anyway.  Might complain about what the ads are, if there are too many feminine hygiene product ones...... 
    I dont think no ads would be a dream at all.

    How many other games which make loads of money from in game purchases have ads. I cant think of any its only mobile games.


    I was referring to GGS doing the right thing by removing the ads.  THAT would have been a dream.  It is now a part of their projected revenue stream.  I have no doubt that the decision was made in the board room around a power point presentation by the marketing team.  The only way they remove this revenue stream is by replacing it with another one that makes as much if not more.

    That is why I HOPE that they can figure out how to make them NON-Intrusive.   Otherwise, this will be a bigger problem than they forecasted.  Oh, have no doubt, they expect to loose a certain percentage of non and small buyers.  The expectation is that the Ad revenue will make up for the loss of the small buyers and that the percentage of non-buyers will be low enough to not impact the gameplay of the Big Buyers.

    Never forget, the final decisions regarding MONEY are made in the board room.  They are expected to reach the revenue targets established by Stillfront Group.  GGS has to pay the owners who have to satisfy the shareholders.  

    The REAL bad news is Stillfront's stock has been taking a dive the last week.  This isn't due to disgruntled GGE players.  But, this will make them REAL reluctant to want to hear from GGS about removing that ad revenue.

    For those wondering, 932 SEK = $107.23 USD = 90.60 Euros........


    Good night.
    Sleep well.
    I'll most likely kill you in the morning.




  • bernhardt (US1)bernhardt (US1) US1 Posts: 978
    Hey, c'mon it's not GGE/Stillfront that's greedy.  It's those Swedish taxes they need to pay to support Sweden's wonderful socialism that's 'proof' that socialism can work.  It can as long as it can siphon money from the outside I guess.
  • PJH_ (GB1)PJH_ (GB1) GB1 Posts: 352
    Just a quick question...

    It says you can avoid adverts with a shop purchase...it then takes you to the shop screen : is it ONLY those specific ruby purchases that count? or do all gge transactions count - e.g. subscriptions?

    I'd been considering a subscription purchase to say thanks to gge but had been put off completely by the implementation of adverts - seems this is the way they'd rather have F2P support them even though the game play stoppage is, at best frustrating and b) builds to irritation and dissatisfaction if you've left feeding starving pixels/ defense rearrangement a bit on the late side....

    Not saying I'd now rush to make a subscription if they count....just if they don't it would really crystalize my medium term plans :)
  • If the ad's i'm seeing (after having purchased rubies in OR) were appearing on my facebook feed i'd have reported them as offensive or sexually explicit - they are against moral standards and have approached the uk advertising standards agency for advice !

    A person sat on a toilet etc. even clothed is not appropriate - children play this game - i've seen players as young as six !in the past !

    @Poseidon X Angel  plus all the other mods = information and constructive comment!
    dandelion1958 @ en 1

    Am still playing 8 years on ! - hi lvl 800 on new yrs eve (2017/18) !

    Leading the Targaryens - PS interested in joining - PM any officer in Game :-)
    taking a more relaxed role:-)
    PS in top200 on uk 1 never botted or used a VPN - that's why it took 5 yrs to get to leg 800
  • Sxlaxs (DE1)Sxlaxs (DE1) DE1 Posts: 13
    edited 18.11.2020

    A person sat on a toilet etc. even clothed is not appropriate - children play this game - i've seen players as young as six !in the past !

    https://prnt.sc/vl2xr6 come again? I think German law applies here since this is a German company. But let's be honest here, it's based on your cookies, not sure what you search, but even then it's just a person sitting on the toilet, u probably don't even see anything intimate...So calm down, it's just an ad..
  • dandelion1958 (GB1)dandelion1958 (GB1) GB1 Posts: 827
    edited 18.11.2020
    @Sxlaxs (DE1) it is classed as uk1 server so uk tax and advertising standards apply - it's innappropriate content for younger players - i find it offensive - there is nothing as " just an ad" ! this is where the evil starts - think how hitler took control - he controled the news and slowly increaed the pressure against minorities !
    dandelion1958 @ en 1

    Am still playing 8 years on ! - hi lvl 800 on new yrs eve (2017/18) !

    Leading the Targaryens - PS interested in joining - PM any officer in Game :-)
    taking a more relaxed role:-)
    PS in top200 on uk 1 never botted or used a VPN - that's why it took 5 yrs to get to leg 800
  • Sxlaxs (DE1)Sxlaxs (DE1) DE1 Posts: 13
    edited 18.11.2020
    Actually, UK law doesn't apply. Just read the ToS you accepted when you created your account. German law applies  
    Read your post and look how disrespectful you are! Comparing a dictator who killed millions of jews with ads! What is wrong with you? This is offensive to anyone, not the ads. Think about it. You see ads with people on a toilet, nobody controls the media. You know how ads work right? You control them! It's based on your search history, just delete your cookies. GGS probably only uses the engine for that. Most, like unity, have a build in ad function, so they can't change what ads are being showed.
    Post edited by Sxlaxs (DE1) on
  • flug (NL1)flug (NL1) NL1 Posts: 1,481

    A person sat on a toilet etc. even clothed is not appropriate - children play this game - i've seen players as young as six !in the past !

    https://prnt.sc/vl2xr6 come again? I think German law applies here since this is a German company. But let's be honest here, it's based on your cookies, not sure what you search, but even then it's just a person sitting on the toilet, u probably don't even see anything intimate...So calm down, it's just an ad..
    they're not allowed to register ,
    you don't have to register to play this game :)  and the most kids are farover 18 :):):):)   (in behavior in the game)
    flug @ nl 1
  • Poseidon X AngelPoseidon X Angel Moderator Posts: 1,355
    Actually, UK law doesn't apply. Just read the ToS you accepted when you created your account. German law applies  
    Read your post and look how disrespectful you are! Comparing a dictator who killed millions of jews with ads! What is wrong with you? This is offensive to anyone, not the ads. Think about it. You see ads with people on a toilet, nobody controls the media. You know how ads work right? You control them! It's based on your search history, just delete your cookies. GGS probably only uses the engine for that. Most, like unity, have a build in ad function, so they can't change what ads are being showed.
    Ah!...the one who thinks he knows it all, and from DE1, what a surprise. You haven't got the server yet sunshine.
    If something is presented in another country then they have to comply with the advertising laws of that country, you could not try to force your beliefs and laws on another country, there is controls. Its just a matter of informing the authorities of any transgressions, so as they can look into it. 

    I can't see that the post compares ad's to a dictator, but rather to the news and media, so that means your brain is making wrong assumptions, that you were probably wanting to see.

    I do not think that GGE is basing their ads on cookies,  as a quick check with players shows all ads being shown, seem to be same, to all players. Most serious geeks have various security options in force on their computers, and many only allow cookies that are permitted through the spyware, and even then many outside cookies are blocked in gaming. So again we have the products of your mind popping up, and calling into question players search histories, and making assumptions. You may search for such topics and subjects, but please don't assume that others are the same. 

    So all in all your not that much in the know are you, so do not make assumptions that you are, or that you speak for other people, like you seem to think you do.
    Now correct me if I am wrong, but, ads should be based of your cookies and thus what you are interested in.
    Second, if you report and ad it's an annoyance towards the people who bought the ad spot, not the ones providing them.

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