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Private Farms
Breor (US1)
US1 Posts: 244
The following was posted by @BM ang1243 in this thread:
Please note that he was summarizing a community discussion between the developers and players on the German server, so the above may or may not be his own opinion.
I recognize that "farming" provides players with a strong incentive to create/maintain a second account, and it gives those who have such an account an unfair advantage. Not everybody has a second level-70 account lying around (accounts need to be level 70 so they can hold legendary resources).
However, I'm afraid the developers don't understand how difficult it is to obtain legendary resources without a farm (spoiler alert: really hard). A single unit of ore per hour is LAUGHABLE production for an iron mine, and building iron mines takes away from public order and food production. Foreign Invaders don't give out enough resources, and players have no control over what they loot, so they often end up with a ton or charcoal and no glass, for example. The reason I'm afraid this is the case is because the developers already proved their lack of understanding when they first introduced legendary levels. They presumably did not realize players were going to farm resources, and so they must've thought basic production would be enough.
I'm aware the developers have said (see above) that kingdom res will now be able to be looted from samurai/nomads. But in what quantity?
If the developers don't dramatically increase the amount of kingdom res that can be looted from the samurai, this change will break the game. Why? Because it gives a huge advantage to players who have already upgraded. They did so the easy way, but now mid-level and low-level players have no path forward.
Here's my solution:
- Impose the limit on resources looted from other players. This means nobody can "farm" anymore.
- Do not increase resources looted from nomads/samurai
- INSTEAD give players a "private" farming castle that no-one else can see. This would appear on the world map with its own graphic. Players could send resources to it and multiply them much like they do now with farming. Everyone 70+ would get one. Not sure how this could be made to make sense in terms of game narrative (what in medieval times would you repeatedly attack for free resources?), but the talented people at GGS could figure that one out.
- Gets rid of the incentive to multi-account.
- Provides players with an amount of control over how much they want to loot. Someone who puts in more effort with their private farm would get more resources.
- Provides players with an amount of control over what resource they'd like. Don't want oil? Don't send your private farm oil!
- Introduces a slightly new mechanic.
Comments
Otherwise I definitely agree
I agree with what you said but GGS is kinda trying to do the same thing you want but in a different way.
The following features and optimizations are aimed at establishing more fairness within the game.
Kingdom Resource Rework
- Keep in mind that these changes are planned to be tested, and by no means are the numbers and changes final.
I don't know which way will help more. I'm not level 70 so I'm one to talk but I just pointing this out.Considering the feedback from the communities and our data, we realized that the time needed to get Kingdom Resources in the Great Empire is too high, given the slow production rate, the high transfer taxes between kingdoms and the looting chances for those resources.
This created a gap between low and high legendary levels that we consider too substantial.
To give some some additional insights, here is some of the parameters we plan to test on the Closed Beta server:
The production rate of kingdom resources will be increased by roughly 450%
More kingdom resource production buildings will have a 100% workload
The costs of kingdom resource production buildings will be reduced by ~66% to 80%
Kingdom resource booster buildings (e.g. "Charcoal Burner") will get two additional levels and won't cost rubies anymore
From what goodgame have showed us on the beta server we will be able to loot 5-6 times the amount of kingdom resources from towers. That sounds pretty good to me. Though we should get more than 5-6 times the ore in the great empire, as the amount we get now is pitiful, but goodgame says they are finetuning the amount we will be getting, so perhaps we will get more ore.
Loot from PvE will increase. Especially in nomads/samurai where we will be getting more ore. But again we will see how much goodgame decides we can get. Hopefully a good chunk.
Combine this with the fact that legendary production buildings will become so much cheaper than now (goodgame haven't said if they will reduce the resource requirements for the HoL yet, though it really should be included aswell). We won't need shell accounts to farm or what you suggest. The loot we get from just participating in events and attacking towers will be enough!
The only thing that goodgame needs to do is make it so we can actually choose which kingdom resource we want. If you attack a foreign invader castle and choose to loot ore, then it should give us mostly ore. Instead of now where we get mostly coal and oil no matter what we choose. That seems like the simplest solution to me.
I'm of the view closing inactive accounts much earlier or at least freezing them out putting them in GGE enforced protection and out of play earlier would be helpful if you want to encourage PvP. Though there are risks in that being exploited by strong less principled players as was an issue in the past.
Alternatively maybe players are allowed to take control of trading posts which are described as on the main trade route for oil, iron, glass or charcoal that allows them extra resource production like a wood or stone outpost.
The process of leveling up always takes time but I think some of the more recent changes have helped and resource production increases suggested sound good.
Definitely worth kicking some more ideas round though.
What a lvl 8 granary costs right now with Master builder lvl 4 on the live server:
That is the kind of reduction in the cost of kingdom resources that we are talking about. No need AT ALL for farming shell accounts anymore!
-DB
Instead of having a "private castle" that you can hit and get resources every 8 hours or so.
Create a Bonus.
Just decrease the amount of loot one gets from a LIVE players castle, and create a bonus according to how many troops the attacker kills (assuming he/she wins.) For example, lets just say I attack a 500 troop castle, and I get a certain amount of loot, for the sake of simplicity, I'm gonna say I got 100 loot. Now, when I attack a 800 troop castle (assuming I win.) Instead of getting 100 loot, I get more, since I killed more troops.
We can also based on glory, instead of troops. It also increases PvP instead of decreasing it.
Hitting two birds in one stone.
No, it's an exploit. You are getting free resources with no penalty, i.e. you don't lose troops or tools. It's bad game design.
You should get all the resources you need from hitting towers and events, farming shells shouldn't be necessary. The only reason they have been necessary so far is because goodgame inflated the resources required to build and upgrade legendary buildings from the get-go. But now they will massively lower the required resources for these buildings, so farming shells will no longer be necessary.
I see no reason to play at the moment. The game is just nomads/samurai and FLs/bloodcrows over and over again. It is boring beyond belief to me. I am waiting for goodgame to implement these changes that they have promised and then I'll see if I want to start playing again.
I came up with the idea of a "private farm" as a reaction to farms being taken away, but some of your comments have led me to realize that perhaps there would be other ways of achieving this, such as a trading post or someplace you could send your resources to be multiplied (without attacking it). What I'd really like to see is a new feature/mechanic in the game.
@MrKennyKRH (SKN1) commented first that he was all for the idea of just looting resources from samurai, and then later said this:
It seems that the game would be made better for him and the rest of us if there was something new brought in, and this suggestion could be the foundation for something new. I don't think the solution to every problem in GGE should be "hit the samurai". We need a game more complex/interesting/diverse than that.
And to the point that GGE is drastically reducing kingdom resource costs, that's good to know. I've heard they're not reducing the cost of the Hall of Legends (hope this isn't true), which would suck because that's what players need to invest in most.
So, for the most part, I still stand behind my idea or a permutation thereof, but thanks for the helpful discussion.
Wouldn't you rather that resources are gathered from sources that we have already have, i.e. towers and events which would be the simplest solution, and then goodgame spend their time creating new events?
If goodgame doesn't lower the costs of kingdom resources on the HoL, like they are going to do with legendary production buildings, then yeah it is absolutely unfair.
But hopefully they'll lower the costs of the HoL aswell and then you won't need farms.
The devs have confirmed in the beta group that the HoL will have "way lower" costs most likely up until lvl 400, and then the following lvls will most likely not have reduced costs. That way it is still a challenge to get the HoL maxed in lvl.
But that means the 6th wave will become much less expensive to get!
Best fix at moment imho would be reduce kres building cost and give more kres at loot npc. That does hurt only ppl who have played "fair" with kres from beginning. I know players who never looted from farms and still lvl800 and build much.
Also if its not possible to build tier system like it is under lvl70, then should maybe introduce some system that could get fires out more easily than it is now. 10k rubies for fires out, its not option for non ruby player.
Biggest issue is that lvl 70/800 can hit easy to lvl 45 up player, no disadvantages.
Would be nice if CAP between attacker and defender is too big, you get every time free fix all fire? Also these free fix ticket could be won by event, but only for maybe lower lvl players?
Legend levels can not use hall on non legendary players.
And also, means they can use like 20 tools on flanks which can be defended with ease.
Why would a level 70 randomly attack a level 45 anyway?