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New Happiness Data (working out the formula)

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Comments

  • LCCGamer (US1)LCCGamer (US1) US1 Posts: 27
    edited 20.03.2014
    Your welcome! Thank you for providing such useful information
  • jaystarr2jaystarr2 Posts: 1,657
    edited 20.03.2014
    Thanks Min! I've been following this and it's really useful.

    Random (possibly dumb) question: why does the graph do those weird little steps? (I'm totally not a math person so there might be a totally plausible explanation for that which I'm missing. :P)

    Also, do you still need more data points?
  • minadequate2minadequate2 Posts: 93
    edited 20.03.2014
    jaystarr2 wrote: »
    Thanks Min! I've been following this and it's really useful.

    Random (possibly dumb) question: why does the graph do those weird little steps? (I'm totally not a math person so there might be a totally plausible explanation for that which I'm missing. :P)

    Also, do you still need more data points?

    The steps are because the percentage is never displayed at 39.7% for example. There is a whole chunk all with the same % if I graphed only the lowest score to get each percentage point it would be smooth but that wouldn't show how at the higher levels you have to add a lot of decos to go up just one percentage point.

    If it was super accurate like totals 0-500 the steps have vertical steps but where I don't know the boundaries specifically they slant. On the otherhand where I have less data it shows as a smooth line (like in the old red line)
  • montuosmontuos Posts: 1,275
    edited 21.03.2014
    While I'm busily building treehouses...

    -91 +195%
    -85 +188%
    -15 +48%
  • BeatrixKiddoBeatrixKiddo Posts: 993
    edited 21.03.2014
    Thanks for creating this thread and sharing information is really helpful for me

    happy weekend ^_^
  • minadequate2minadequate2 Posts: 93
    edited 21.03.2014
    Thanks for the kind word and the data you sent me :) I've added it to the spreadsheet and will release an updated +% graph at some point (fingers crossed with a old vs new comparison if I get enough data)
  • Twiglet (GB1)Twiglet (GB1) GB1 Posts: 1,174
    edited 21.03.2014
    hi after removing buildings and putting on decs my main farm is running at +353% if i was trying to get it into the - i would have to delete all buildings and just have decs ??? so how do i get into the -
  • Larino (INT1)Larino (INT1) Posts: 4,572
    edited 21.03.2014
    uksharon3 wrote: »
    hi after removing buildings and putting on decs my main farm is running at +353% if i was trying to get it into the - i would have to delete all buildings and just have decs ??? so how do i get into the -

    - is easy with some good decos. Just -100 is not. My farm is running fine at -85% and still has enough production buildings. 6 apples, 1 cherry, 7 cows, 4 pigs and 4 chooks. If you want to get above -85 you will need to go all decos though :)
  • Twiglet (GB1)Twiglet (GB1) GB1 Posts: 1,174
    edited 21.03.2014
    i used to run my farm at +300 so if i got it to +300 now would i be on the same as i was before? i dont understand this and this is really turning me in the direction of exit the game and find another i have never know a game that causes so much stress rather than pleasure.
  • Twiglet (GB1)Twiglet (GB1) GB1 Posts: 1,174
    edited 21.03.2014
    if i have to go all decorations whats the point in having a farm ????
  • Larino (INT1)Larino (INT1) Posts: 4,572
    edited 21.03.2014
    uksharon3 wrote: »
    if i have to go all decorations whats the point in having a farm ????

    The idea is that you do not need to have -100. If you want that you'd better give up right now, because you will not reach it. Like I said, mine is running fine at -85% and I am staying there. I used to have -100, but forgot about that idea real soon. This is the new normal unfortunately for the players that were used to -100.
  • Susi SonnscheinSusi Sonnschein Posts: 1
    edited 21.03.2014
    Hi Minadequate,
    I compile data in the german forum. If you need more row data take a look of this site:
    http://de.board.goodgamestudios.com/bigfarm/showthread.php?90250-Neue-Werte-f%C3%BCr-Zufriedenheit-Betriebskosten-ab-18.03.14&p=1658179&viewfull=1#post1658179

    Happy farming!
  • Twiglet (GB1)Twiglet (GB1) GB1 Posts: 1,174
    edited 21.03.2014
    i dont want to be -100 i want to be close to where i was before the update to be earning the same amount of profit
  • Marcella59Marcella59 Posts: 59
    edited 21.03.2014
    hey uksharon, if you remember what you were paying for cherries that would be a start. you could remove some decorations and check your cherries. keep doing that until you get what you decide is acceptable
    i just went and removed a bunch of my decorations before update i paid 35,000 for cherries after update and at +298% it costs 34,787
  • Twiglet (GB1)Twiglet (GB1) GB1 Posts: 1,174
    edited 21.03.2014
    i cant remember what i was paying for cherries all i know is i was earning enough on my farm to keep me in cash to upgrade stuff but now it is seeming to take ages to get any profit all i know is my farm was running at +300 i have deleted some chickens and pigs , cows and apple s and in place put some decorations on now farm is at 353% so dont understand if i need to delete more or am i close to where i was i dont understand the graphs at all
  • Marcella59Marcella59 Posts: 59
    edited 21.03.2014
    Okay look at your cherry now, if you are not paying more than 30,000 or 35,000 to start then I'd leave it like it is for a day or two and see if you look like you're making the money you were making.
  • Woodstock MWoodstock M Posts: 110
    edited 21.03.2014
    minadequate2,

    Great job on an excellent piece of work.

    Can I make a suggestion? There are some happiness number missing but some bordering number are there and percentage the same.

    Those missing happiness number and corresponding % can be filled in and a filter applied so easy and quick to search.
  • minadequate2minadequate2 Posts: 93
    edited 21.03.2014

    Amazing Susi great minds think alike! I will definitely make use of your resource soon.

    minadequate2,

    Can I make a suggestion? There are some happiness number missing but some bordering number are there and percentage the same.

    Those missing happiness number and corresponding % can be filled in and a filter applied so easy and quick to search.

    Yes woodstock i just put in the numbers I was able to find... and I didn't really want 4000 odd lines in the spreadsheet! But i agree if I put more in it would be more easily searchable, susi's resource above might be better for that...
    uksharon3 wrote: »
    I know is my farm was running at +300 i have deleted some chickens and pigs , cows and apple s and in place put some decorations on now farm is at 353%

    If you want to get back to +300% you now need a happiness total of around -215 if you currently have 353% you probably have a total of around -345. Therefore you need to add a further 120 (ish) happiness points be 4-5 decorations or by demolishing a house (or 2) now you have some free workers, or a mixture of the 2.

    The graphs are useful just to highlight where you get good returns in running costs but the raw data might tell you what you need in future.
  • minadequate2minadequate2 Posts: 93
    edited 22.03.2014
    I've had a few thoughts on the changes and if needs be (if this turns into a fight) I will move/remove them... but for anyone who wants to know my analysis of the graph please see the updated first thread. (Update 2)
  • musicdoc2musicdoc2 Posts: 20
    edited 22.03.2014
    Minadequate, GG should hire you. They would have benefited by this analysis to achieve their stated goal before this unpopular update was imposed. Thanks for your hard work helping all of us to adjust to the new rules.
  • minadequate2minadequate2 Posts: 93
    edited 22.03.2014
    Haha I don't know how much use my architectural skills (what I'm trained in) would be to GG, but I certainly would be more reliable than Steve in terms of turning up when I say I'm going to.

    This has been an interesting process thou, glad people are enjoying my ramblings
  • freerange (US1)freerange (US1) Posts: 135
    edited 22.03.2014
    I have discovered that the relationship between happiness and running expenses (as opposed to % running cost) is smoother than we think. I decided to find out how much the update was actually decreasing my income. I placed decos on my flower farm to make it -82% as the equivalent of the previous -100%. Then I started writing down numbers. But I am not really the correct person for the job haha. I got fed up and quit. But in light of some of what we are finding out I decided to try again. And this time when I took off a different set of decos to get to -82% the new numbers did not match the ones I had previously written down. So I played around and discovered that running expense does vary by the amount of happiness within each of the percentage steps!
  • pop1pop1 Posts: 341
    edited 23.03.2014
    That's a really great analysis! You made a compelling argument. :thumbsup:

    As for the possitive curve, i think it never reaches absolute +500% due to limited space, how much more can you build? :) And maybe gate, fence & doghouse happiness value contribute a small fraction away from +500%.
  • montuosmontuos Posts: 1,275
    edited 23.03.2014
    freerange6 wrote: »
    So I played around and discovered that running expense does vary by the amount of happiness within each of the percentage steps!

    That's because the running cost percentage is displayed as an integer, but it is in fact calculated to at least 2 decimal places, and judging by the nursery costs display error, probably to 3 places or even more.
  • freerange (US1)freerange (US1) Posts: 135
    edited 23.03.2014
    Thanks montuos.
  • lucy822lucy822 Posts: 89
    edited 23.03.2014
    wow, reading this was like being in maths at school and feeling like the only kid who didn't get it!!
    Awesome work though!

    Can anyone explain the cherrys bit to me - is the 30,000 bit what you are paying in maintenance to start them off? Cus mine says 1,196 which is sooo much less than 30,000 that you are either talking about something else or im doing alright?!

    In simple terms, is there an optimum percentage to be running at? or is that still as low as possible as it was before (my main farm is on -86%)

    thanks!
  • Larino (INT1)Larino (INT1) Posts: 4,572
    edited 23.03.2014
    lucy822 wrote: »
    wow, reading this was like being in maths at school and feeling like the only kid who didn't get it!!
    Awesome work though!

    Can anyone explain the cherrys bit to me - is the 30,000 bit what you are paying in maintenance to start them off? Cus mine says 1,196 which is sooo much less than 30,000 that you are either talking about something else or im doing alright?!

    In simple terms, is there an optimum percentage to be running at? or is that still as low as possible as it was before (my main farm is on -86%)

    thanks!

    About the cherries that is indeed when you start them. The farms they are speaking about are running on almost mass production, so between +500% and +300%. These farms were doing fine on mass production before the update, but not so much right now. They want to get back to where they were before the update, so still mass production but same income. 30,000 is around the price for +300% before the update, so that would be an indication for them that they are back where they were.

    For now I think -85% is as good as it gets and is the new normal. Just like -100% was the old normal.
  • amaprincess1 (US1)amaprincess1 (US1) Posts: 636
    edited 26.03.2014
    Incredible reverse-engineering job!

    I haven't seen it so I farted around and somehow managed to get exactly to 0. And yes, 0 does in fact = 0%, if one can imagine such a thing.
  • lucy822lucy822 Posts: 89
    edited 30.03.2014
    Thank you Larino, that's really helpful!
  • snork (INT1)snork (INT1) Posts: 518
    edited 30.03.2014
    I'm glad you did this, mina, because it hopefully made more people aware of something I noticed right from the start.

    I asked Latten about it and am not sure if they ever replied, because I was so upset I didn't come back to check, until today, when there are ninety pages I won't slog through.

    GG always insisted, right until their official statement (that said nothing new) that the changed happiness was rewarding balanced farmers and discouraging factory farms. Which never made sense, and I kept asking why the expletive it then punishes balanced farmers like me (seventy to eighty percent and rising).

    Larino's joking decoration farm post is what all my farms actually look like! I regret placing that last ugly totem pole today, now you confirmed it was all for nothing, the "gain" in percentage really was a net loss.

    I'd be grateful for anyone (esp. official) to tell me again why those above sixty percent happiness needed to be punished.

    One of my farms is basically empty soil now - it works just as well with only one production unit per type, and I tore down all the expensive decorations for cash. Exactly the opposite to what GG intended.

    I know many people who left the game completely - like our co-op leader - and I might as well.

    *sighs*
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