The Library

paultje19752 · 11.12.2013

monica79538 wrote: »

I would NEVER have bought gold for staff that would leave after 5 days. The books cost half as much and don't expire. AND they can be upgraded too. This is an update that does cost gold, but low enough that I think i can almost afford it.

only the first level is reasonable the second level is already not...not evne mention the other levels (cause i not know because lvl1 is only i will buy)

but yes i agree with everyone that the gap between gold users and non gold users is getting very big and is in mine opinion getting to big. (and i am a big gold buyer)

the missions which have been open for much discussion are getting less and less atractive for non gold users. nd with that also for the gold users cause missions with 2 players is no fun

jaystarr2 · 11.12.2013

One thing about the library is that you don't know how much books cost until after you have forked out money for them. So if I have spent some non-trivial amount of gold on a book only to find it gives me a piddly +3 corn after the fact, that's definitely going to affect my view of whether I want to spend more gold on other books, especially if the cost of it goes up considerably.

I have a question--what reasons are there for the library being a gold-only feature?

Tony444 · 11.12.2013

jaystarr2 wrote: »

One thing about the library is that you don't know how much books cost until after you have forked out money for them. So if I have spent some non-trivial amount of gold on a book only to find it gives me a piddly +3 corn after the fact, that's definitely going to affect my view of whether I want to spend more gold on other books, especially if the cost of it goes up considerably.

I have a question--what reasons are there for the library being a gold-only feature?

they want more people to buy gold so they make more $$$

gizmo22 (AU1) · 11.12.2013

Its simple......missions will now never be fair. Farm upgrades were about strategy, upgrading your fields and other production facilities and setting up your farm in a way that would best compete with others during missions. All that strategy is now taken away because u cannot compete fairly with someone that has bought up a few books with gold. The main gripe with missions in the past was the major disadvantage non-gold buyers had when they were in competition with gold buyers. GGS stated they would do a mission overhaul to make the competition fair but this library update has just made the gap between gold and non gold buyers even bigger. The mission overhaul seems pointless now because I cant imagine how it could possibly be fair when you come up against a library book stocked competitor in a "collecting" mission.

I buy gold occasionally and while I don't like this update I'm not going to blame GGS and threaten to leave. They need money to run this game and i'm sure many hours are spent trying to come up with a strategy to do that. One thing I do want though is the ability to remove the library avatar itself from my farm. The library thumbnail can remain in the farm options section for later use if I feel the need to buy a book but having this huge library sitting on the edge of my farm is very distracting and looks ridiculous.

jaystarr2 · 11.12.2013

Tony444 wrote: »

they want more people to buy gold so they make more $$$

Well, that's probably the obvious, cynical answer. I don't doubt it. But is there any, game-specific reason why books have to bought with gold and not cash? Like would buying books with cash ruin whatever game economy we have or make it too easy to advance or something like that?

PopaGamer2 · 11.12.2013

I think this should be periodically event, like architect.
if you buy license/book/seed you have it permanent like architect level, but not always available.

OGG (GB1) · 12.12.2013

that library is just like the stuff that comes out the back of my animals

ambrielle (US1) · 12.12.2013

I do buy gold from time to time but I think we got shortchanged on this library stuff.I rather have the hired workers back,I did use them especially during our co-op missions and 890 gold for 1 worker was kind of steep but at least it covered all of my fields or all of the animals instead of dividing the fields in corn or wheat or cabbage(whatever you planted was covered by the worker.It's the same with the orchards,why are they split? Cherries and apples separated.I just don't care for it and doubt seriously if I will be using it.Goodgame needs to quit basing everything on gold use,it's not fair to the non gold buyers.I understand that they have to make money but you are going to lose more if this keeps up.Just my humble opinion.

ice cold3 · 12.12.2013

I don't know whether this is a coincidence or not, but we had a discussion on our forum about introducing more options for players who prefer the "singleplayer" mode, like the possibility to do a mini-research or something, and voilà! The library appeared.

I really like the fact that it's NOT oriented toward cooperatives; single players should have some advantages as well

lilchik703 · 12.12.2013

short79 wrote: »

I suppose every update is suppose to wow and inspire awe every single time? And you mention that every week you get excited about the new update. Am I to understand that the previous updates over the past several weeks have failed to ignite nothing more then bitter disappointment? Then why on earth do you keep playing? However, if the doghouse and new upgrade levels, the various new events have all serve to please you then the developers have indeed made the game more fun after all. Just because an update here and there isn't all diamonds and glitter shouldn't mean that the quality of the game is lessened. And if they choose to introduce something that promotes gold purchase then so be it. This might come as a shock to you but developing games COSTS money and lots of it!
I continue to be baffled by the sheer number of people who are offended by a game, that is free to play, can continued to be played successfully for free but does offer specialty items and benefits at a real price cost. And these extras, mind you do not affect your continued gaming. Not to mention, the players who are wiling to buy are in fact, very essential in keeping this game available to play. Sure you may not get the top of the line decos and will have to exercise a good deal of patience but the game is fully playable without. And even for those who do use gold, such as yourself there will be different reasons for different players to buy and spend gold. Just because the devs have offered an update that doesn't match your specific idea of fun, doesn't mean it will be the same for other players. And I wouldn't be a bit surprised if players using this feature are plentiful.
And this feeling that "GGS is focusing on more ways to taunt us with using and buying gold instead of making the game fun"? Just sounds incredibly foolish to me because if a game is not fun, there would be no players and I am not seeing a widespread abandonment of Big Farm. Instead it keeps bring in new players all the time. As for taunting, please! Taunting is an action in which something is kept just out of reach, usually in order to force a desired reaction. If GGS were to allow players only a certain amount of advancement before the game came to a halt, requiring a gold purchase or membership to be able to continue, perhaps taunt might be accurate. But that is just not the case here.
It is very simple. It costs millions of dollars to provide this "free to play" game. However, Big Farm has it's share of players who like to purchase and spend gold which is a very good thing because spending millions developing versus free to play doesn't exactly balance out. And any game developing company would be a fool not to provide these players with different, interesting and useful ways to spend their in game currency. It is quite necessary for the devs to offer features that will generates sales, thus earning an income to ensure the continuation of this much enjoyed game, which would otherwise fade away into nothingness as a result of bankruptcy!
Maybe you could discuss a feature that was fun for you. Instead of talking down something that is standard, for every single last business, of any kind, anywhere. Encouraging the sale of their product. And I would think it obvious that there is enough clientele to make it worth GGS time to develop this update.

I dont have to explain to you why I chose to continue to play. The main point of this post was to say that GGS is putting all their efforts into coming out with more gold things, instead of coming out with things that have been suggested such as more projects for coops, and THE 4TH FARM. This is my problem. I buy gold, so I support the game developers, but I do believe that they are developing things that separate gold users from non gold users. I like the dog house, how it is mostly cash, then gold. The idea of this library is ok, but not having cash involved leaves out a majority of people to participate, and also 490 gold is kind of reasonable for the first level (some amounts like corn may have to be tweeked) but 5900 and 2500 for the 2nd level?! I'm afraid to know what the last level is. I like more events, it benefits everyone brings new things to the farms without spending gold. The new barn only made me realize that I could get by with only 1 red barn so I guess that was helpful to me in the way that GGS did not intend for it to be. There are plenty of ways that people can spend gold in this game, I just think that GGS should be focusing on putting out the updates they already said they would before making more updates only centered around gold buyers. And by the way, as mentioned in post, people are already leaving this game. Did I miss anything? I don't feel like re-reading that novel and explaining myself... again.

connerk2 · 12.12.2013

Nice of you not to mention the "costs millions of dollars" thing.
The overhead for running a game server is enough that most college students can afford it.

Oh and game development?
Usually unpaid interns.
I'm guessing our forum moderators are all volunteers.
Since there is about 11,000 players, your estimate of millions seems extremely far-fetched.
Of course we might creep up to 100,000 if all servers are counted, but I doubt they are all paying $10,000 a year to play.

Cyndi33 (US1) · 12.12.2013

Although GGS offers us free weekly gold, in comparison to other online games, GGS is making too many unwise strategy decisions for game players.

The Library, very much like the Gold Mine, is a rip-off.

I'm not satisfied with the game results of the real amount of money you demand from me, whatwith GGS building the Library and the Gold Mine. Furthermore, GGS lowered the graphics design of my fields, in order to offer us a Level 7 field. I worked hard to save my money for a high quality Level 5 Field. GGS's decisions are lowering the morale of the game players.

I would not support minor age children playing Big Farm. They are not taught the benefits of managing their money, in order to maximize both the production of their farms and for the good of society (i.e., the co-op). Instead, GGS demands more real money from game players.

I ask GGS to attentively listen to the concerns and to respond to them accordingly. We are your allies. I sincerely wish GGS to be rated the #1 game.

Overall, I'm becoming less satisfied with GGS Big Farm's strategy decisions for game players. Unfortunately you'll see an increase in numbers of people quitting this game. For both GGS's own good and for the good of the farmers, I hope you you send a supportive letter you are listening to our concerns, and "support those who sincerely wish you the best."

gyodaf · 12.12.2013

I need further info about how this library works.
Example:
Lv 1 corn handbook cost 490 gold and we get +3 corn.
Lv 2 corn handbook cost 1500 gold and we get +5 corn.

I have lv 3 field, with base corn production is 17 without library.
If i have lv 2 corn handbook, how many production do i get?
17+5 or 17+3+5 ?

short79 · 12.12.2013

connerk2 wrote: »

Nice of you not to mention the "costs millions of dollars" thing.
The overhead for running a game server is enough that most college students can afford it.

Oh and game development?
Usually unpaid interns.
I'm guessing our forum moderators are all volunteers.
Since there is about 11,000 players, your estimate of millions seems extremely far-fetched.
Of course we might creep up to 100,000 if all servers are counted, but I doubt they are all paying $10,000 a year to play.

How do you figure these numbers? Just of the top of your head, perhaps? This company uses hundreds of servers all over the world, in which case the game has to be translated into a variety of different languages for the many different nationalities playing. And if GGS has over 168 million registered users from all over the world playing their games, it can be easily assumed that at least a million of them play Big Farm. And don't make me laugh by suggesting unpaid interns. GGS has 600 plus staff and is the fastest growing gaming company in Europe. They also develop all their own technology and technology is by no means cheap. All things considered, I believe your claim "I doubt they are all paying $10,000 a year to play" may possibly be a rather uneducated guess as I imagine it costs a whole great deal more than that to make all that possible. The only thing you are right about is that the mods are generally volunteers but then again it is common for game forums to have regular game players serve as moderators. So, no millions may not be as far-fetched as you suggested above. Next time, you might consider doing some research before responding to this particular subject matter...

Lee-Ann3 · 12.12.2013

total disappointment. i was really looking forward to the library but 490 gold for 1 extra chicken feed? no sa u guys need to go back to the drawing board with this one. i will not be using this feature.

short79 · 12.12.2013

lilchik703 wrote: »

I dont have to explain to you why I chose to continue to play. The main point of this post was to say that GGS is putting all their efforts into coming out with more gold things, instead of coming out with things that have been suggested such as more projects for coops, and THE 4TH FARM. This is my problem. I buy gold, so I support the game developers, but I do believe that they are developing things that separate gold users from non gold users. I like the dog house, how it is mostly cash, then gold. The idea of this library is ok, but not having cash involved leaves out a majority of people to participate, and also 490 gold is kind of reasonable for the first level (some amounts like corn may have to be tweeked) but 5900 and 2500 for the 2nd level?! I'm afraid to know what the last level is. I like more events, it benefits everyone brings new things to the farms without spending gold. The new barn only made me realize that I could get by with only 1 red barn so I guess that was helpful to me in the way that GGS did not intend for it to be. There are plenty of ways that people can spend gold in this game, I just think that GGS should be focusing on putting out the updates they already said they would before making more updates only centered around gold buyers. And by the way, as mentioned in post, people are already leaving this game. Did I miss anything? I don't feel like re-reading that novel and explaining myself... again.

I can honestly say that I did not see your initial post in this light and to me it had come off as yet another accusation of GGS being greedy. However, after reading your post here I see that I was quite mistaken. The further details you added brings to light some very valid points and arguments and since I decided not to give much attention to the library I hadn't been aware this sudden price jump and I do have to agree that is unreasonable. No doubt it would have been nice if there had been some farm dollar books but just decided to accept that the library looks cute on my farm and no more. There have been a higher volume of updates that have centered around gold users but with all the events, new level addition to our buildings, along with the dog which was cash up to level five, It is my opinion that GGS has found a decent balance between providing for both non-gold and gold using players. Can't say I know anything about more players leaving the game or not. My co-op mates aren't all that affected by this update so no leaving there. One thing you did mention that I hands down completely agree with is GGS taking the time to provide us with more projects! So much so I want to demand that they drop all other updates and go right to work on that. With that being said, I understand a lot better what it was you were getting at. And major kudos to you on a your thorough breakdown of my "novel" (thought I was the only one who called my posts that! LOL). I do hope you will accept my sincere apology for that bit of reading work. I write until I'm done and this is what seems to happen. And no, don't re-read it again as you are to be highly commended for reading it all in the first place. Thank you for taking the time to explain as I was able to see the errors I had made reading your first post. I am sorry that you were so excited about this update only to have it give you such a hard blow of disappointment. That really bites! Here's to an update that will hopefully knock our socks off! Again, sorry for all the over writing...take care!

mandy.h892 · 12.12.2013

I think this makes the game less fun than it should be for those who can't buy gold. I myself have spent money to buy gold but times are hard for everyone and some have no way to buy gold. I think the first level should have been cash to buy for those who can't buy gold. It would make it more enjoyable to them and they wouldn't feel so left out all the time. Plus you let kids play so how are they to ever buy gold? I for one wouldn't let my child use a credit card. Lets think of ways to be fair to all who play and enjoy the farm.

Eryol · 12.12.2013

I’m not a gold player, but I can't criticize the games creators for looking new ways to take some of our money… they need it to keep going. The only problem I see is that the competition (if possible) between gold players and not gold players is turning more in favor of gold players each time this people make a new "update"… This is clearly true in the missions. As the game allows the majority of us to play for free (which I really appreciate), maybe they should keep not gold players and gold players separated… just maybe. For now I just can think twice before get on a mission and enjoy to making my farm and cooperative grow. Cheers.

Kat Nip (GB1) · 12.12.2013

That's just it, the books are the same concept, just presented differently to the Staff that was available from the very first day of the game, until very recently. There's no difference between someone wanting to purchase a Staff member or a book then entering into missions.

Everyone's upset about this all of a sudden because it's finally been noticed, but this has always been the case. As I've said repeatedly now, the books are just a different presentation to the Staff feature that caused too many bugs so it was removed.

People who were willing to purchase Staff have been playing missions with that advantage for the life time of the game (with the exception of the few weeks where we were between the Staff and the books) - there's absolutely nothing new here.

Kat.

dSign (SKN1) · 12.12.2013

Same or not, it doesnt matter.
Players are your customers, and now customers are uppset.
Mainly because this gold issue is getting more and more number1 priority in this game.
It used to be at background but now its getting more visible, why ?

Perhaps after next updated we have to invest some gold before log in ?
I see that it's only matter of time.

Personally i think that its time to stop playing this, it's not fun anymore...

gizmo22 (AU1) · 12.12.2013

Kat Nip2 wrote: »

That's just it, the books are the same concept, just presented differently to the Staff that was available from the very first day of the game, until very recently. There's no difference between someone wanting to purchase a Staff member or a book then entering into missions.

Everyone's upset about this all of a sudden because it's finally been noticed, but this has always been the case. As I've said repeatedly now, the books are just a different presentation to the Staff feature that caused too many bugs so it was removed.

People who were willing to purchase Staff have been playing missions with that advantage for the life time of the game (with the exception of the few weeks where we were between the Staff and the books) - there's absolutely nothing new here.

Kat.

Its not the same as the staff because the books add numbers to harvest permanently. Most of us knew that some players used staff in missions but that was alright because these changes were temporary and if they wanted the same advantage a few days later they would have to purchase staff over and over again. If the player wanted to spend so much gold rehiring staff every few missions then fine, let them have that advantage. Most would eventually stop using staff for missions and compete strategy wise. All the library has done is given players the opportunity to purchase a permanent advantage therefore making missions even more unfair and swayed towards the gold buyer. I buy gold on occasion but there will always be that handful of players that will win every single mission because they were willing to spend more and that is my main issue with this update......missions will be even more unfair now.

lilchik703 · 12.12.2013

short79 wrote: »

I can honestly say that I did not see your initial post in this light and to me it had come off as yet another accusation of GGS being greedy. However, after reading your post here I see that I was quite mistaken. The further details you added brings to light some very valid points and arguments and since I decided not to give much attention to the library I hadn't been aware this sudden price jump and I do have to agree that is unreasonable. No doubt it would have been nice if there had been some farm dollar books but just decided to accept that the library looks cute on my farm and no more. There have been a higher volume of updates that have centered around gold users but with all the events, new level addition to our buildings, along with the dog which was cash up to level five, It is my opinion that GGS has found a decent balance between providing for both non-gold and gold using players. Can't say I know anything about more players leaving the game or not. My co-op mates aren't all that affected by this update so no leaving there. One thing you did mention that I hands down completely agree with is GGS taking the time to provide us with more projects! So much so I want to demand that they drop all other updates and go right to work on that. With that being said, I understand a lot better what it was you were getting at. And major kudos to you on a your thorough breakdown of my "novel" (thought I was the only one who called my posts that! LOL). I do hope you will accept my sincere apology for that bit of reading work. I write until I'm done and this is what seems to happen. And no, don't re-read it again as you are to be highly commended for reading it all in the first place. Thank you for taking the time to explain as I was able to see the errors I had made reading your first post. I am sorry that you were so excited about this update only to have it give you such a hard blow of disappointment. That really bites! Here's to an update that will hopefully knock our socks off! Again, sorry for all the over writing...take care!

After re-reading my original post, I agree I did not get the point I wanted across. I think I wrote it out of a bit of anger, and lack of sleep lol. Happy farming!

tinyandme (US1) · 12.12.2013

The Library is a JOKE!!

End of Story.

short79 · 14.12.2013

oljah2 wrote: »

Oh, this subject would like to tell you, that you may have good manners, but not great sense of justice !

Justice, is a more or less a myth as it rarely happens. And again, this...is a game not a court room. No lawyer would stand before a judge, claiming that an online game is unjust to it's players, and should be put on trial. So unless this game is responsible for a bank robbery or a murder, or some other real crime, justice and online gaming just don't have anything to do with one another. Justice is a serious matter for real life.

tinyandme wrote: »

The Library is a JOKE!!

End of Story.

Some players may disagree so no, that doesn't end the story at all.

Post edited by Kat Nip: Merged posts, please use the edit button

tinyandme (US1) · 14.12.2013

But a lot say yes. That ends the story.

[Gelöschter Benutzer] · 14.12.2013

Or at least, it ends the first novel in the Trilogy, anyway.

connerk2 · 14.12.2013

short79 wrote: »

How do you figure these numbers? Just of the top of your head, perhaps? This company uses hundreds of servers all over the world, in which case the game has to be translated into a variety of different languages for the many different nationalities playing. And if GGS has over 168 million registered users from all over the world playing their games, it can be easily assumed that at least a million of them play Big Farm. And don't make me laugh by suggesting unpaid interns. GGS has 600 plus staff and is the fastest growing gaming company in Europe. They also develop all their own technology and technology is by no means cheap. All things considered, I believe your claim "I doubt they are all paying $10,000 a year to play" may possibly be a rather uneducated guess as I imagine it costs a whole great deal more than that to make all that possible. The only thing you are right about is that the mods are generally volunteers but then again it is common for game forums to have regular game players serve as moderators. So, no millions may not be as far-fetched as you suggested above. Next time, you might consider doing some research before responding to this particular subject matter...

World of Warcraft is the biggest online game ever with 12 million users and operating costs of about $200 million for game development and server maintenance and supports 2.5 Million servers. You do understand the difference between a registered account and actual user correct? So roughly $1.2 Million a year per server which would support 480 K players (not registered user) each. You think GGS is even close to competing with that?
hhahahahahahahahhaha
Ever run a server...I have. Is that research enough for you?
Cost about $500-$600 a month in the U.S. to support 5-6 K players with fast connection speed and the vast majority of that goes straight to the IP service.
That is all.

short79 · 14.12.2013

connerk2 wrote: »

World of Warcraft is the biggest online game ever with 12 million users and operating costs of about $200 million for game development and server maintenance and supports 2.5 Million servers. You do understand the difference between a registered account and actual user correct? So roughly $1.2 Million a year per server which would support 480 K players (not registered user) each. You think GGS is even close to competing with that?
hhahahahahahahahhaha
Ever run a server...I have. Is that research enough for you?
Cost about $500-$600 a month in the U.S. to support 5-6 K players with fast connection speed and the vast majority of that goes straight to the IP service.
That is all.

Nope, that is NOT all. See I never claimed that GGS was close to competing with anything at all. I just pointed out how wrong your figures were. But since you brought it up, I believe that you're still lacking, both in numbers and research. GGS may have, and it's now 169 million registered users. Of course being registered doesn't necessarily mean these all these users still actively play as well that there may be only one user to multiple accounts so yes, I can differentiate between a registered account and actual user. Incidentally, even if the numbers had to be cut down by half due to the previous statement, you are still likely looking at 84.5 million people actively playing and with just one account, compared to WOW's rather unimpressive 12 million.
Now I understand that when talking about GGS, this number of users is for a number of GGS games where WOW is just one game. But, here's some irony for you, and remember you decided to play the comparison game not I. First, your research skills...get some because I don't think you did anything of the sort. If you wanted to try to outdo GGS I'm pretty sure WOW was a poor choice to go with. Why? First, it is a subscription game. As I can tell the difference between a registered account and an actual user, do know the difference between a free to play game as opposed to a game that requires a subscription? Big difference. And second, that 12 million you boast so proudly about is actually more like over 10 million and and even that is a "once upon a time" number as WOW experienced a steep decline in subscribe users this year. WOW is now down to just over 7 million subscribers.
I don't know but it looks like the joke is on you. But I don't need to "ha-ha" about it. I'm sure there will be plenty of that whenever I read through whatever feeble "research" you come up with next. And when you say you have "run a server", I'm going to have to assume that you actually mean a person who waited on you in a dining establishment. Did you want to try this again?

ezio auditore3 · 14.12.2013

Alright guys, take it easy

As long as this is a civil discussion, there's a chance that whatever the demands of this thread are, will be considered and the reason I say 'whatever the topic' is because I lost track after the first 20 posts..........:/

momoma (GB1) · 14.12.2013

short79 wrote: »

Justice, is a more or less a myth as it rarely happens. And again, this...is a game not a court room. No lawyer would stand before a judge, claiming that an online game is unjust to it's players, and should be put on trial. So unless this game is responsible for a bank robbery or a murder, or some other real crime, justice and online gaming just don't have anything to do with one another. Justice is a serious matter for real life.

Maybe the life isn't fair because there are those who a priori think that life is unfair.

Justice is a matter of common sense and logic...

And now I know, Cerberus isn't very smart.

The Library

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