Home EN General Discussions & Questions

Toolboxes

SystemSystem Posts: 106,832
This discussion was created from comments split from:
How does it work again?.... Marowit is here, Game Designer 
& from:
Hi, I'm Meela, The Numbers Guy.
Post edited by WascallyWabbit (FormerMod) on
«13

Comments

  • ashim (IN1)ashim (IN1) IN1 Posts: 572
    edited 10.03.2017
    hi marowit , hope due to u here , ggs will get less ticket now  :)

    1. I wanted to know the condition that triggers lester because lester is not visiting to my farm from past 8months and  why lester is not coming to non gold buyer even i spend 52k gold in last 45 days ? It is necessary to buy gold ( one condition to trigger lester ? )
    2. Can you tell why the quantity for tools is reduced now , we got 4 new machine and we have 2 cc in a month , i am thinking we need more tools to play cc and opening new machine too .

    Thnks for sharing your precious time with us :)
  • MarowitMarowit Big Farm Team Posts: 59
    @ashim (IN1)

    Both question were already asked and I answered just a bit above
    "The overall drop rates for the silo, mill and composter were way to strong compared to the other buildings.


    Basically every time we added a new level to those buildings we made them more and more powerful because we added more stacks and reduced the time it takes to make one stack

    It was an oversight from us.

    The machines were supposed to be a long term goal, not something that can be achieved within a week or so.

    If we let them like they were everyone would get them in 2-3 weeks and then ask for more new machines, vicious circle.

    I agree that the timing was bad but what we noticed is that some players managed to upgrade the new machines within a day of their release, and they got those tools from skipping not from buying them.

    What you do need to understand is that sometimes bugs are not only something that are of an inconvenience to the user, sometimes they cause exploits, such as the drops for the silo, we still have to adjust them nonetheless.

    What if one day you would have a button in solitaire that makes you win the game with just 1 click? Would you still bother to play the game when you know you can win with no challenge?"


    "Sorry but I can't give you the exact conditions on how to trigger Lester right now, it's like asking me for my secret pasta sauce recipe D"

  • MarowitMarowit Big Farm Team Posts: 59
    edited 10.03.2017
    @gavinfarms (US1)

    The drops should have been adjusted at the point we added them to those buildings, so it's a very old bug.
    Which we only noticed now.


    If you look at what happened in the last 2 levels, we have increased the number of stacks by 50%(from 40 to 60) and reduced the time to make one stack by around 15%.

    So this is a gigantic improvement in terms of drops. Which should never have happened in the first place.

    The adjustment didn't happen because we added new levels now, or because of the new farm machines from now.
    It happened because we just noticed the problem now.

  • ashim (IN1)ashim (IN1) IN1 Posts: 572
    @Marowit
    we have 2 cc in a month . hardly we get 5 tools now in a day , so in a month 150 tools max
    A cc is of 4 days , if we start powerhouse thrice in a day of 50% then it takes  12 tools daily , so in 2 cc 96 tools were used , so in a month we will get 54 tools as a saved amount

    it takes more than 1 yr to open all new machine , if it is going like this
  • @Marowit

    Marowit, Thank you for taking the time to explain the reasoning behind the reduction in the tool drop rates.  It seems the tool drop rates are a settled matter, so let's redirect and expand the "tool drop" dialogue to a focused and specific remedy for the players' day to day farm production concerns as a result of the reduced tool drops.
     
    In a continued effort to help you understand the players' experience, I'll start with an idea: Perhaps GGS could increase the Farm Lab's productivity of premium humus?


    Grandma Molly @ us 1
  • nola1 (INT1)nola1 (INT1) INT1 Posts: 187
    Hi @Meela, welcome to the forum!

    May I voice a couple of requests:

    Any chance you could scrunch up those toolbox numbers again? Their sudden droprate reduction was too much for me..



    And also about the temp farm timing, id rather have back the full time for my candy farm.. Any reduction on my candy supply wont cure my addiction, it'll just make me cranky, as any withdrawal does *noisily and forcefully chewing candy* It would be easier than figuring out over months the rebalancing of total voucher droprates, greenhouse seeds and horseshoe conversion to balance out the shortened temp farm.
     
    hi Meela  .. yes please can you address the toolbox drop rate  xx
    nola1 @ WWW 1
  • Jiesta (NL1)Jiesta (NL1) Posts: 6,557
    Excellent post, Scissors - THX! It says it all! Smileys Smileys en emoticons Dansend


    Sig designed by farmerjohn 22 (US1). THX!!

     

  • Southern (US1)Southern (US1) US1 Posts: 3,268
    edited 14.03.2017
    Marowit said:
    Now back to the time based drops : 

    {Math Removed}
    Morowit,

    Thank you for that detailed insight into Toolbox Drops.  Just the fact that (now) knowing they're time-based rather than drop-chance-percentage based gives us valuable information and also confirms several theories I had based upon my own observations as I noticed that drops from my stables appeared to be in a pattern, almost always coinciding with a certain "number" of harvests.  Now I know why, because the "Xth" harvest is when "TP" (Hey, don't look at me, it's your acronym :smile:) would break 100, and a toolbox would drop. :)

    If I could ask one question in regards to the Silo, Composter & Stables - do they all share the same "TP" Pool?  IE., if I reach 99 "TP" on the Silo, then harvest a pigsty which (for instance) generates 1TP, would a toolbox drop, or would I need to wait until the next Silo harvest to break the 100 "TP" barrier? (I have a feeling based on my observations that it's all one pool, but I'd like to confirm if possible.)

    (This would explain why some people see 0 toolbox drops even after harvesting 24 Fertilizers 3x in a row in the Composter).

    Again, thanks for this insight; it's greatly appreciated! <3
    Post edited by Southern (US1) on

    Success Team is an active, friendly co-op looking for daily adult players. Click here if interested or apply in game today! :)
  • Southern (US1)Southern (US1) US1 Posts: 3,268
    Marowit said:
    Now with a level 1 silo it takes you 3360 seconds to drop 7TP(this is one stack) you can make 3 stack so you get 21TP after the whole cycle.

    3360*3/21= 480 seconds per TP

    With a max level it takes you 960 to get 3 TP, you can do 60 stacks in total so you get a total of 120 TP.
    960*60/120= 480 seconds per TP

    The result is the same amount of TP per second, just as all the other buildings.

    Also, may I assume that not every building has the same "480 Second per TP" rate as the Silo? (48,000 seconds per Toolbox)

    Because otherwise, a full production CowShed (25,200 seconds) would guarantee a drop with every 2 full productions, and that's certainly NOT the case. :)

    As always, any insight greatly appreciated. :)

    Success Team is an active, friendly co-op looking for daily adult players. Click here if interested or apply in game today! :)
  • gavinfarms (US1)gavinfarms (US1) US1 Posts: 2,273
    Marowit said:

    The problem was that the silo and composer were too overpowered even with just 5 levels, so this was something that should have been changed from day 1.

    The tool drops for all buildings per cycle stay the same as you upgrade them.

    However, technically the tools drop per stack, silo and composer have more stacks and the time per stack goes down as you upgrade the building, which is something we neglected until now.

    So the adjustment makes sure the tools drop more closely to the actual time it takes to make one stack.


    Drops are based on the time it takes to finish production, what comes out has no impact on the amount of drops, also rarity of the elements required to start the production is taken into account, that is why sunflowers drop more than wheat.

    Now back to the time based drops : 

    1st tools drop in pieces, every production drops some tool pieces, how ever you will only see it drop, and be able to use it once you gathered 100 tool pieces, let’s call this TP(bad acronym I know :))


    Now with a level 1 silo it takes you 3360 seconds to drop 7TP(this is one stack) you can make 3 stack so you get 21TP after the whole cycle.

    3360*3/21= 480 seconds per TP

    With a max level it takes you 960 to get 3 TP, you can do 60 stacks in total so you get a total of 120 TP.
    960*60/120= 480 seconds per TP

     

    The result is the same amount of TP per second, just as all the other buildings.


    Edit:
    The adjustment of the prices happened because the tools were severely overpriced. And buying them was more expensive than just to skip the production.
    This is still the case but only for the last 2 levels of the silo
    On the two portions that I have put in bold..........I interpret this to mean that with a maximum load of the silo, I get 120 tool pieces (which is more than the 100 necessary).......Therefore, I should always get a toolbox to drop, every single time with these maximum loads.  Is this correct?  (Because that is not actually happening every time)
    gavinfarms @ us 1
  • gavinfarms (US1)gavinfarms (US1) US1 Posts: 2,273
    Can you give some similar information on drops from cows and chickens and pigs?  For example, does a person get more drops from 10 chickens if they are higher levels, or 10 do level 1 chickens work just as well.  Or is it simply every 60th (or whatever) chicken harvest?......and so on?
    gavinfarms @ us 1
  • PCA (GB1)PCA (GB1) GB1 Posts: 839
    edited 14.03.2017
    Meela said:


    2) I'll look into the numbers again, especially for new places in the game where tools could be given out. So no going back to silo and composter being so much better than the other buildings, more akin to some suggestions in this thread, like a lab recipe, buildings on other farms etc. While making the silo and composter worse was justified, not offering a new alternative wasn't, so I'll try to fix that.


    Thank you for the explanation @Meela

    Please do not limit the possibilities to the laboratory because if that was the case, once again all the low level players would be in trouble, it would take a very long time before any of them were able to produce any tool boxes in a laboratory which costs a fortune to upgrade

    Actually, to keep the focus on the low level players, the best places that should  drop more toolbox sub-pieces should be all the production buildings in main farm.

    Every low level player starts from main farm, upgrades and expands it first, so that is where the focus should be. Windmill is built since very low levels, so are fields, and animal sheds.  

    You have increased the number of machines in the game, and also the number of machines which need to be activated.

    The number of  toolboxes needs to be increased accordingly, and people have to be able to start collecting adequate numbers of toolboxes since very low levels, unless GGS expects us to simply buy tool boxes instead.

    In the end it makes little difference to the players whether the increased drop rate of tool boxes is due to an increased number of parts/cycle or an increased number of building which drops them or a combination of the two, as far as we get more tool boxes than we used to, rather than less as its happening now

     




  • Jiesta (NL1)Jiesta (NL1) Posts: 6,557
    Meela said:

    2) I'll look into the numbers again, especially for new places in the game where tools could be given out. So no going back to silo and composter being so much better than the other buildings, more akin to some suggestions in this thread, like a lab recipe, buildings on other farms etc. While making the silo and composter worse was justified, not offering a new alternative wasn't, so I'll try to fix that.
    THANKS @Meela  Smileys Smileys en emoticons Blij


    Sig designed by farmerjohn 22 (US1). THX!!

     

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Emoji
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file