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Loss of 10 hour boosters

Since July we have not had a 10 hour boosters for the first 10 hours making us use single booster 
a hour hour booster costs. $3.726.000   to   then hit for 10 hours would cost us $ 2.335.600.000
due to paying hourly it cost us $ 3.726.000. 000    

3.726.000.000 - 2 335.600.000  we are owed 1 390 400 000   up to now we are missing over 5 billion 561 million 600 thousand 

I would like to know just how many people are you taking this money from and not returning it....

is anyone else having the same problem , maybe this is a way GGs are trying to get us to use your gold by not letting us have the 10 hour boosters ... funny how the gold one works but the farm money does not... That is just plane stealing.

Do GGS want to loose everyone on the game they take the money from the fish they take the money from the lack of boosters and they are devaluing the rates of every thing.. take take take... Just how long to they think the people will put up with this..

Comments

  • aaabbb1 (INT1)aaabbb1 (INT1) INT1 Posts: 1,049
    @hendso, sorry, but I do not understand what your complain is realy about?

    It is true that a 10 hour booster costs less then 10x1 hour booster. But it is common that you get a discount, if you buy in larger quontities. In this case, you are paying for 6 hours and are getting 4 hours extra.
    If you coose to pay 10 times one our booster instead of buying 10 hour booster and therefore paying greater price, that is your decision and your probem. If you go to the shop and you have a deal package of 10 liters of milk saying (6+4) and having the price of 6 liters of milk, but you decide to buy 10 packages of 1l, than its your decision and your problem, not the problem of the shop owner. 

    Or I am getting you wrong? Are you buying 10h booster and game is deducing you price for 10x 1 booster instead of the discouted price for 10 boosters? If that is the case, than its probably a bug. I will pay an attention to it next time. 


  • paultje1975 (US1)paultje1975 (US1) US1 Posts: 163
    the first booster is for everyone only a 1 hour booster
  • Cedar (US1)Cedar (US1) US1 Posts: 67
    I guess I'm not "understanding" the confusion...

    Problem:
    GGS advertises a reduced rate, during Coopcha, for boosters with a significant savings given for purchasing 10 hours v.s buying every one hour...for both gold & farm dollars.  Since July, we have been locked out of participating in this savings using farm dollars; costing us extra for hourly gold purchases and creating huge headaches with having to track every one hour to reload boosters. This loss of promoted savings/convenience has extended for 10 hours into every Coopcha...not simply the 1st hour.

    Question:
    1. ) Are all Co-op's experiencing this issue, or just a select few?
    2.) When can we anticipate a permanent resolution to this, or is it GGS's plan to eliminate the 10 hour promotion for farm-dollar booster purchase as advertised?

    Comment:
    If it is GGS's plan not to offer the 10 hour savings, then ethically they should not advertise promotions...to do so is fraudulent. We simply ask that you deliver on products that you advertise & be accountable when errors are made, with resolution provided in a timely manner.  Clear enough, now?
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    As the leader of Crystal Clear i have contacted GGS over and over about this problem to be told , Its a difficult fix and they will not refund our lost cost .. GGS are making us pay in our cash booster by the hour WE DO NOT have the choice to buy the 10 hour discounted deal... Im sorry if some of you did not understand what i was saying maybe next time I will find and easier way to spell it out ....
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    Paultje1975 I think i have already learned we pay for the first hour of the booster  "I get that " after all I have been running my own co op for some time now.  If you read carefully I am saying WE do NOT get the choice of the deal of 10 hour boosters , we have to pay one hour at a time, costing our co op an amazing amount of money.  So considering GGS are stealing from us billions of dollars  we are doing great.
  • I am a member of Crystal Clear - we buy the one hour booster but when we go to purchase the 10 hr booster it would not work - that is why if we  had to purchase it hourly if we wanted to have co op boosters.  now do you understand - the 10 hr booster did not work!!! 


  • jess_d (US1)jess_d (US1) US1 Posts: 3,515
    @hendo (US1) Do your members leave the co-op before buying the boosters in order to start it cheaper? If so, that could be the problem since GGS fixed that. 
  • aaabbb1 (INT1)aaabbb1 (INT1) INT1 Posts: 1,049
    edited 13.09.2017
    @hendo (US1) , @jess_d (US1)  is right.

     The reason I did not understand your complain is because 10h booster worked fine in our coop. 

    As the expence of the boosters depends on number of coop members, some coops developed a strategy in which all but one or two members left the coop. This lonley member bought the booster for a very low price and everybody entered the coop again. To stop such behaviour, GGS changed boosters in such a way, that the members that joined the coop after the booster is activated, do not get benefits from the booster and can not prolong it.
    So, next time, do not leave or rejoin or accept new members while the booster is on.

    If this is not the reason, the only other reason that I can remember is that you did not have enough coop money in your account to by a 10h booster.

    If thats not either, try writing ones more to support and try to explain them more carefully and with more details what exactly had happend. Try sending them some pictures as well.
  • RowdyRac (FormerMod)RowdyRac (FormerMod) Guest Posts: 1,250
    @hendo (US1) 
    @Maggielin2085Ma (US1)

    Here is the answer to your question :smiley:

    I am not a techie so it goes something like this :  
    yada-yada-yada integer wraparound yada-yada-yada.  
    Sorry I cannot be more specific but these are my limitations :(

    It seems to boil down to the game code not being able to handle numbers larger than 2,147,483,647.
    This applies not only to CC booster but also, for eg. to the amount of money that a farmer can donate to a coop.   So if someone is making a very large donation to their coop, best they break it down into amounts less than $1,200,000,000 each, just to be safe.

    Enterprising farmers have also found the following workarounds for you to consider regarding the CC booster.

    *  buy a 65% booster in stead of a 70% booster, so that the 10 hour fee falls below the 
    2,147,483,647 number

    *  continue using the hourly one  (but lose out on the reduction in costs)

    *  the booster will also be cheaper if you have less members and although no-one wants to kick people out for this, it might be an option if you still have members on the books and know that they will never be active again.

    They are looking into ways to solve this problem and we will post here in the forum as and when we receive news about progress in that regard.

  • paultje1975 (US1)paultje1975 (US1) US1 Posts: 163
    edited 13.09.2017

    ah ok i understand

    seems CC is only one using the 70% boosters then since no other coop reported it :)


  • Cedar (US1)Cedar (US1) US1 Posts: 67
    I neglected to mention that I am also a member of Crystal Clear earlier.

    This problem:  
    **Being blocked from using the 10 hour farm-dollar (CASH) boosters for the first 10 hours of every Coopcha start **

    ...Is a recent event and now an ongoing issue since July.. as Hendo stated
    Prior to this we have used this option routinely without problems.
    Why this occurs only during the first 10 hours of Coopcha's is yet another curiousity
    Everything points to yet another GGS Hot Mess.... oh, excuse me,  "Hot Fix" blunder.

    I am not familiar with "Integer wraparound" (nor do I care to be, lol), but we simply pay for our boosters from our Co-op account....as I'm sure the vast majority of co-ops do. No one person is footing the bill.

    Obviously continuing to suck it up & go with hourly (CASH) boosters &/or reducing our membership size are not acceptable options to consider...thanks for the suggestion (?)

    It appears, once again, that GGS will make no effort to correct or be held accountable for this SNAFU. While you'd expect them to honor their promotions and provide restitution for monies lost, it simply isn't going to happen. As always, the membership is SOL.

    It appears then, that the 70% option for 10 hour farm dollar (CASH) boosters for the beginning of Coopcha will no longer exist.  How crazy is that?

    As this will never be explained or broadcast (let alone fixed), future unsuspecting co-ops will also fall into this trap & get sucked into dumping their savings into hourly boosters.... directly into the pockets of GGS.
    Not fixing known issues such as this is a pretty smooth money making move, GGS... great job : /

    I think we all shudder at the thought of yet another "Hot Fix" .  
     
  • RowdyRac (FormerMod)RowdyRac (FormerMod) Guest Posts: 1,250
    @Cedar (US1)

    I am sorry to see that you are ready to lay your problem at the door of a "hotfix blunder", rather than paying closer attention to the explanation about the number 2,147,483,647  and how the game is unable to deal with numbers greater than that.

    The original poster indicated that the 10 hour booster for your coop is $ 2.335.600.000 -as you will notice, that is indeed larger than 2.147.483.647.  

    Therein lies the problem.

    This is not new, possibly you only notice it now because your coop did either not buy such large boosters in the past, or now have extra members  (since the price of boosters are determined by the number of members)

    Additionally, if your coop had been using the exploit of having everyone leave the coop before buying boosters to last the entire CC, and had been using it for a while, this will explain why you had not noticed the problem with the 70% booster before.  
    You would not have encountered the limit if there was only one person in the coop buying boosters so they would have been much, much cheaper, right ?
    This exploit was fixed by GGS a number of CC's ago. 

    It is odd that you are apparently the only cooperative that experiences this problem, which leads one to wonder whether other large coops, do not use the 70% booster.
     
    Relating to your words:  
                 "As this will never be explained or broadcast (let alone fixed)",

    please note that I have in fact explained the reason for it in my post.  
    Neither is it hidden in any way: your coop reported it, we went looking for an answer for you. 
    And as stated above:  
    They are looking into ways to solve this problem and we will post here in the forum as and when we receive news about progress in that regard.
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    edited 13.09.2017
    no matter what option we use for booster %   be it 50%  60% 70% 80% 100%   the dam 10 hour booster will not work thus GGS is making one heck of a lot of money while we have to click every hour and WE DONT GET A DEAL making us work even harder than all the other co ops.  

    I doubt if any other co op would admit to having this problem as to them it would show a weakness..
    I want it brought out into the open they take money from the fish but we are having to pay more for our boosters than others.

    Hendo


    Edited to remove personal remarks towards another player.  Rowdy

  • RowdyRac (FormerMod)RowdyRac (FormerMod) Guest Posts: 1,250
    edited 13.09.2017
    @hendo (US1)
    @Cedar (US1)

    Here is what you need to do then.

    When the next CC comes round, please take a screen shot of the booster buying window showing how the button is greyed out for 50%, 60% and 70%  (so 3 screenshots in total).  If you do not want to post them here in the forum (because there are personal details on them), then please send them to one, or all, of the moderators in a private message.

    Any other coop experiencing the same problem but who may be too afraid to show weakness, must please do the same  (no need to post here, send it in a PM).

    If the amounts required to purchase the boosters are larger than $ 2.147.483.647 then there is nothing that can be done about this at the present moment (they are still working on a solution).  
    You may rest assured, however, that you are not paying more for your boosters than any other coop of similar size who uses a booster of similar size.

    If the amounts for the 10 hour boosters are smaller than $ 2.147.483.647, and the button is still greyed out, we will froward this problem to the appropriate people for looking in to because that requires another explanation.


    Edited to remove a "0" that slipped in where it shouldn't have.
    Post edited by RowdyRac (FormerMod) on
  • Cedar (US1)Cedar (US1) US1 Posts: 67
    If we are paying hourly v.s in 10 hour packages, we are most definitely paying more with more additional headaches. I'm not understanding how that isn't obvious.

    Your suggestions seem reasonable enough. Unfortunately this has been allowed to go unanswered far too long.
    Hendo's been working on this since July, having contacted GGS **numerous** times, sending many snapshots.
    Presenting this to the Forum is actually a last-ditch attempt to get anyone to listen.

    Again, why it only lasts 10 hours should red flag the situation as a definite technical issue & should not require even more months of US proving GGS's error. So, we go through yet another Coopcha with the same issue, document as you suggest, then GGS decides whether or not to look into it? There's just something very wrong with this scenario... Hmmmm. 

    Seeing whereas we are paying them, perhaps they can actually provide a service, research their glitches & deal with issues they create.... preferably within the facsimile of reasonable time.



  • Cedar (US1)Cedar (US1) US1 Posts: 67
    ..Additionally:  After learning of the standard routine Coopcha strategy employed by other co-ops, we did also use the "leave & return" method of attempting to maintain advantage... Once & months ago.  As this strategy was standard practice by other co-ops we did not view it as exploitation, but as just that...strategy. Funny we should be accused of "exploiting" when we're the one's who have lost vast amounts of our cash.

    Your previous statement:
    "It seems to boil down to the game code not being able to handle numbers larger than 2,147,483,647."

    "Seems" would indicate that that this statement is theory, not actual fact, requiring further investigation.
    Now you say  "
    Therein lies the problem." ...as though it is a known fact & that I'm not paying attention (?)
    It is very enlightening to just now learn that "This is not new" 

    As to you comment about:  "...lay[ing] your problem at the door of a "hotfix blunder"
    I can only use your words  "This is not new"


  • RowdyRac (FormerMod)RowdyRac (FormerMod) Guest Posts: 1,250
    edited 13.09.2017
    I saw your coop mate's question  (the original post).  
    I asked the other moderators if they knew anything about this.
    We spoke to the  CM.  He explained about the "integer wraparound".  He offered to explain the more technical details if you should require it.  
    I returned here and answered your question.

    For some technical reason, the game cannot deal with numbers larger than $ 2.147.483.647.  
    The 10 hour booster you are trying to buy during CC are for amounts larger than that, therefore the game cannot accommodate your wish of buying boosters of the amount that you would like.  
    This is true for any coop that tries to buy such a large booster and not just for yours.
    GGS is aware of the integer wraparound problem.  They hope to eventually find a solution to the problem.

    If you prefer not to take up the offer of taking screen shots for us during the next CC, I have no problem with that.  Help was offered but need not be acccepted.
    Post edited by RowdyRac (FormerMod) on
  • mia111 (GB1)mia111 (GB1) GB1 Posts: 741
    edited 13.09.2017
    [...]

    Your previous statement:
    "It seems to boil down to the game code not being able to handle numbers larger than 2,147,483,647."

    "Seems" would indicate that that this statement is theory, not actual fact, requiring further investigation.

    [...]

    About number 2,147,483,647 (equal to 2 to the power of 31 minus 1): it is the maximum positive value for a 32-bit signed binary integer in computing (first bit used for the +- symbol and the 31 remaining bits for the value). It is therefore the maximum value for variables declared as integers (e.g., as int) in many programming languages, and the maximum possible score, money, etc. for many video games.

    A bit is a 0 or a 1; computers only work in binary code (a code/language consisting of 2 symbols/numbers/characters/values), aka 0s (off/false) and 1s (on/true). Computers work in binary bases (bases of 2) and many things in computers work in multiples of bytes. A byte is 8 bits (2 to the power or 3). Thus 32 (8 times 4, also 2 to the power of 5 or 8 to the power of 2) is 4 bytes, which is how an integer is represented in a computer.

    Edit: correct typo
    Post edited by mia111 (GB1) on
  • RowdyRac (FormerMod)RowdyRac (FormerMod) Guest Posts: 1,250
    Thank you @mia111 (GB1), for filling in the details of the yada-yada-yada part of my explanation.  
    Much appreciated  :smiley:
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    edited 14.09.2017
    Right at the beginning of the challenge like any leader I hit the 1 hour cash button, then I got to hit the 10 hour cash button,  I am told there is not enough gold.. lol  in the cash section I then take a screen snap of it and send it right away to GGS...  NOTHING happens  this is the third time I have told them they are stealing billions since july we are told we will get NO refunds for there mistake... Now tell me if this was happening to you and you were not getting good responses what would you do ???? 
    Post edited by hendo (US1) on
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    I am fighting for the billion dollars my coop is paying every time we go into a challenge.. I have listened to GGS since July i have watch while dealing with this issue the change in the cost of fish...they have altered the numbers to make things harder while all the time the leaders are trying to build wonderful communities GGS seem hell bent on just not building a good place for us all to be..

    We are loosing people we are loosing our friends due the the mistakes "that are too hard to fix" I could fill this page with all the emails I Have had from GGS all saying they are not stealing from us ... Really I do not think for one minute many people playing this game would agree.... its very sad that the very people who are paying your wages your actually stealing from no matter what fancy excuses you put in the forum.

    Hendo   and my name is Christine 

  • Shay1968 (US1)Shay1968 (US1) Posts: 1,324
    I don't see how this can be an integer overflow problem if it is ONLY happening during the first 10 hours of the challenge  but is fine after that.  Also if it were an integer overflow problem then there are ways to mitigate the overflow.  This is supposed to be a growing game,  if mitigation methods are not set in place then this is already a dead game.

    If indeed this particular problem is an integer overflow problem;
    Maybe it's time to switch to a 64-bit signed integer.

    Or perhaps a third currency can be added ... bonds ... we can convert large amounts of cash to bonds in set amounts. 1 million dollar bonds, 10 million dollar bonds.  Maybe these bonds can also earn interest. 
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    Im fighting for the rights of my members in my co op . As a leader that is what i am supposed to do... How far spread is this bug  if its not why just us.... paste and copy ...GGS has expert people working on the bugs yet this bug has gone on for months if it was costing them billions they would be changing it as quick as they change the fish payments .. as it not to hell with us we only pay the wages of GGS.  Im screaming out for this to be sorted out I have hidden this problem for a long time and enough is enough to be told by GGS yes there is a problem find a way around it , is insulting what Im being told from GGS..    ohh yes   I forgot  "with due respect I ask you to fix this problem
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    In reply to your comment.paultje1975 (US1) said:

    ah ok i understand

    seems CC is only one using the 70% boosters then since no other coop reported it :)


    if no other co op reported it maybe they dont want to look weakened by this matter of could be that out of all the co ops we are the only one's who have this problem for the first 11 hours which also is very strange AS i AM THE ONLY one who sets the booster i can assure you I do not set them at 70% nice of you to make a comment but i think it offers little help to the 
  • I don't see how this can be an integer overflow problem if it is ONLY happening during the first 10 hours of the challenge  but is fine after that.  Also if it were an integer overflow problem then there are ways to mitigate the overflow.  This is supposed to be a growing game,  if mitigation methods are not set in place then this is already a dead game.

    If indeed this particular problem is an integer overflow problem;
    Maybe it's time to switch to a 64-bit signed integer.

    Or perhaps a third currency can be added ... bonds ... we can convert large amounts of cash to bonds in set amounts. 1 million dollar bonds, 10 million dollar bonds.  Maybe these bonds can also earn interest. 
    @Shay1968 (US1) As far as I know it is not only in the first 10 hours, the button is greyed out when the price shown is higher than 2,147,483,647 & that can happen for the highest % booster, with the longest time, when you have a large coop. 

    You may recall a recent Mod Bulletin where another issue came up with this number, involving donations to coops - The problem there was that it was not greying out the button & causing a bigger issue as a result.

    As Rowdy has said, the team are on it & the only option until then is to use whatever combination makes the booster price lower than that amount, whether its reduction the %, the time or the number of members (if there are some inactive ones bumping the number up).
  • paultje1975 (US1)paultje1975 (US1) US1 Posts: 163
    edited 14.09.2017
    Rowdy Rac said:


    It seems to boil down to the game code not being able to handle numbers larger than 2,147,483,647.
    This applies not only to CC booster but also, for eg. to the amount of money that a farmer can donate to a coop.   So if someone is making a very large donation to their coop, best they break it down into amounts less than $1,200,000,000 each, just to be safe.



    the highest XP in german server is higher then this number i noticed. so maybe the donation guy has to talk to the XP guy to get lessons in counting and help....:)

  • Shay1968 (US1)Shay1968 (US1) Posts: 1,324
    edited 14.09.2017
    Rowdy Rac said:


    It seems to boil down to the game code not being able to handle numbers larger than 2,147,483,647.
    This applies not only to CC booster but also, for eg. to the amount of money that a farmer can donate to a coop.   So if someone is making a very large donation to their coop, best they break it down into amounts less than $1,200,000,000 each, just to be safe.



    the highest XP in german server is higher then this number i noticed. so maybe the donation guy has to talk to the XP guy to get lessons in counting and help....:)

    @paul Perhaps the German server has already been upgraded to a 64-bit signed integer.  I could completely understand waiting until it is necessary to upgrade considering it would also require more RAM which is not to be considered cheap. But if boosters are exceeding the maximum amount, perhaps it IS time to upgrade OR lower the cost of the boosters across all servers. 

    Also, @wascallyWabbit, I was under the impression that it was only an issue during the first 10 hours based on this statement by another forum member that was trying to understand and help the situation, "**Being blocked from using the 10 hour farm-dollar (CASH) boosters for the first 10 hours of every Coopcha start **".  It is possible I could be mistaken that this was her understanding and not Hendo's dilemma.  Hendo has indeed confirmed it is the first 10 hours that she cannot use the 10 hour boosters. Therefore, this cannot be an integer overflow problem.  Especially if it does not matter how big or how small of a 10 hour booster she tries to buy.   I am glad the team is on it, because this is certainly not fair to her coop. I hope the team can resolve the issue quickly. 

    But from what Hendo is saying and from the screenshots I saw, it does not appear to be integer overflow problem. He stated no matter what size 10 hour booster he tries to buy he gets a popup that says not enough gold.

    Confirmation from @hendo (US1)  as to whether or not it is just the first 10 hours or continuous throughout the entire challenge would be great.

    Post edited by Shay1968 (US1) on
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    edited 15.09.2017
    Ok I will go through the motions as i do when the co op challenge starts .. I click on the amount of % the co op can afford and works well at.. Then I click on the 10 hour offer AND IT DOES NOT WORK..  I keep saying the same thing over and over.. I have added email replies from GGS only to have them taken off.. so I will add them again.. so they can not hide from what they are doing..


    Edited to remove the screen shot.  Community guidelines says:   Do not post text logs, PM logs or Email conversations of chats with the forum staff or GGS Support. 
    That is why it was removed from your post before, and also why it had to be removed again.
    Please have a look at the Community Guidelines for posting on the forum.
    Post edited by RowdyRac (FormerMod) on
  • hendo (US1)hendo (US1) US1 Posts: 33
    edited 16.09.2017
    I have had this issue going on since July and I"m pretty fed up with the whole situation, how simple is it to understand THE FIRST 11 HOURS OF THE CHALLENGE i can not hit the 10 hour button.. meaning i have to hit the single one hour button for the first 10 hours.. costing the co op billions of dollars in which GGS is not going to refund us .... how many more times do i have to keep repeating the same thing. ???? oh my word. Experts run this game ,  "where are they"

    hendo




    [Please see your PMs | Wabbit]
    Post edited by WascallyWabbit (FormerMod) on

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